The college book market is ridiculous. You can torrent some.. but it's difficult. Good luck.
So I work full time, and finally bit the bullet and decided to go to online colleges in my spare time.
Every single online-only college I see requires you to buy these bullshiat e-books which are always over 100$ in addition to the per-credit costs (except University of Phoenix, but no thanks!)
Is there any reputable colleges out there that instead of farming $$$ on e-books, simply add the required material to the online course itself? I always knew college textbooks were a scam, but hoping for a way around it ;\
Wasn't there some site that sold overseas market textbooks that are essentially identical to the US counterparts, but they are like 1/20th the cost?
1) Suck it up and buy them
2) Try to torrent them, and when you can't, see 1).
I have a book this semester that is over 200 dollars. Its previous edition is 18.50. The instructor on day 1 said "you can't get away with the previous edition gaiz."
It's the college textbook mafia.
Colorado State University is a pretty good choice if you want to go the online route. When you sign up for the classes they assign the book(s) and you go and buy them however you choose to. You actually can't even buy them through the school itself, but they have a handful of sites they suggest. There are a ton of options out there now, either buying it outright, renting them, or even renting the e-book. There are even some classes that you can get away with not buying the book if you are at all familiar with the material in the class. Some of the instructors will reference material straight from the book, and others won't, so you sort of take a gamble if you don't get it. Also, you have to be pretty self driven as the instructors aren't super hands on unless you engage them a lot. For me this is perfect because I prefer to work on my own anyways, but some people have a hard time with it.
Anyways, give them a look and see what you think.
I would be more concerned about the quality of online only college than the books it requires.
It might not be online-only. A lot of legit 4 year universities now offer full online degree programs. Since he's already stated his aversion to the University of Phoenix, it looks like he knows to stay away from the shams like them and the other for-profit online only universities.
One of my friends girlfriends just recently got a degree from Capella University (online-only like U of Phoenix) and shockingly, she's having a lot of trouble even getting an entry-level position with her degree.
They might be cheaper than the online degrees from a traditional 4-year university, but you also get what you pay for. What good is a degree that is 1/2 price if people look at it unfavorably when applying for jobs? That's wasted money. At that point you're only going to have an advantage over people with absolutely NO college degree, but I don't know any employer that would treat something like the University of Phoenix on anywhere near even ground with a traditional university degree, all other conditions being somewhat equal.
If the course just says, "Know chapters 1-5 for quiz 1, chapters 1-10 for quiz 2." Just buy an older edition. You can usually find them for like $5-20.
Just don't rent. That shit's a scam (worked at a text book distributor for 2 years). Best advice is to buy it on something like half.com and resell it at the end of your semester. You'll lose some money, but hopefully no more than 20% of the purchase price after cost of shipping to the buyer.
Yeah I rented a book once. I never used it at all for the course and it never left my coffee table. Brought it back and they told me it was too damaged and I wouldn't be able to return it. Assholes.
If it is a for-profit college you should not go there.
I used to think people trashed resumes with shit like University of Phoenix on them. However, in my current job I've seen hundreds of resumes of people working on government contracts and the amount of diploma mills listed on them is staggering. All of these positions are IT/tech related, so maybe the degree isn't as important in those fields? Whatever the case, have a "for profit" university diploma doesn't seem to be quite the black mark that it used to be.
I guess I would automatically look at an online school as "lazy". Of course, if it was my job to hire people I don't know what I'd do.
Pretty much the only reason to get a degree from an online-only would be if you are in a current job position, you are qualified for a promotion, but you have been told you can't be promoted without a degree(for whatever reason). Then get the quick & cheap degree just to satisfy that job requirement.
Trying to actually use it on the open job market isn't going to do much for you at all.
You can rent books from Amazon for $18-30 now or just buy an older edition. I've bought older editions for at least 15 different classes and labs in subjects like Biology, Organic Chemistry, Physics, History, and English. Not once was I ever out in the cold because the lecture covered something that wasn't in the book. It's a HUGE racket, but there are plenty of ways to get around it without spending $1k+ a semester on books.
I also trash any online degree. I feel a bit bad, but I need some criterion and that is a good one to get me towards a more manageable level. I personally do not trust the degree and I typically hire in the science field and without lab experience you are essentially useless.
I thought about going to UCLA or USC for a full time MBA, but even then I couldn't justify the cost and 2 years of not working. Even if I landed a strong six figure salary, it wouldn't really be worthwhile.
The problem with old editions is if the teacher assigns problems from the book. A lot of the time the problems are slightly different between editions.
Internet age. Any kind of physics, math, or chemistry class is going to have homework posted online through mymathlab, masteringchemistry, or whatever. No college professor in 2013 wants to spend 20 hours a week grading homework from problems assigned out of the book. Maybe there are some colleges or dusty old professors out there that still do, but im 112 hours into a BS in biology and I haven't been required to work a single problem from the back of the book.
Library Genesis had to problem getting books here
Last edited by Big Phoenix; 01-15-2014 at 07:47 AM.
My profs for msc econ gave questions from the books all the time, but never without posting those questions up so it wasn't like saying open your book and do question 2.a or whatever.
They just need to do courses like old copy protection in Sierra games.
1. Please state the third word in Section 2.2 table 2.10 of the 2014 Microelectronic Circuit Design by Richard Jaeger and Travis Blalock
Pussy bitch Draegan sold us out to MMORPG.com
Exodus underway to Rererolled - A Gaming Community
Oh and sorta fuck Tuco too.
If you are hiring and throw out a resume based on "online degree" alone that is silly. Unless you are dealing with 900 applications.
Im hiring two positions now. Lots of online degrees, lots of normal "in field" better known colleges, lots of ITT Tech bullshit, and ten times more SUNY DEGREE IN BULLSHIT FIELD.
If im hiring IT, ill take someone with a Phoenix Online degree over someone that went to Syracuse for Anthropology, or Theater Design, Or Art History with a concentration in 13th century france or one of the other "non real world job" degrees. I focus on experience, job history and if they look promising interview skills.
This isnt the 50s. A college degree is just a check in the box for EVERYONE.
That said, Online classes gouge on the books, never buy from the "school" - always shop used book sites. Buy them for cheaper, then sell them back for a little bit. Still going to take a big dick in the ass on costs.
I've only worked with two people with online degrees. One from DeVry one from ITT. The former is a very competent programmer the other was a moron.
Thats about par for the course in all walks of education
True I work with quite a few people from traditional CS routes that can't program out of a brown paper bag
Every colleague I have who has a "degree" from places like University of Phoenix, Kaplan, etc., write shit like "could of" or "should have did" in their professional writing. I don't know if they're just idiots or what, but I know during my first degree at a real college if I had written that garbage on papers I would have been skewered.
I chalk that up to "most people are morons". Its true.
I have a guy working for me with an English Degree from a great school and half of his professional emails include short hand, internet chat phrases or emojis. Ur, Lol, 2 instead of to....its bad.
What I have seen is all of the people I've come across that have online degrees right out of high school (not really the night school types, but someone early twenties with an online degree) lack functional social skills. They cannot even carry a conversation during an interview. We have a generation of kids who grew up on the net and lack interpersonal skills, all think they need a 4 year degree in digital arts, and are not prepared for the real world.
Thats another thing I look at for Degrees, is when they graduated. If I see someone has been in the Work Force for 20 years and has a degree from an online place 5 years ago, I take that into consideration. Working person trying to better themselves and their career. Might not know any different. Kind of like the OP seems.
Last edited by Gunnar; 01-15-2014 at 03:54 PM.
I have a bachelor's from DeVry (I was 18 and didn't know any better and they gave me a scholarship) and I can tell you that it is a real school, not a degree mill. Less than half of the class that started with me graduated and there were plenty of people with C averages and I don't think anybody in my class finished with straight A's. I got a 3.74 GPA and worked my ass off for it. The professors were hit an miss, but I think that is the case in most schools if you're not going to Stanford or Harvard or something. They only hire people with industry experience and they focus on lab work so it's very practical. They also schedule all of their classes either in the morning or the afternoon so you can work during the other half of the day. You can also go half time at night.
The best thing about DeVry though was the job assistance. I had probably 10+ interviews before I graduated, all set up by the school, and it was better times in the tech industry, but almost everyone in my class including me had a job before graduation. I don't think many traditional schools would give you that. Also, they said that you could come back and use their job assistance office for life if you get a degree from them although I've never tried to utilize it.
The only real downside I encountered was when I looked into graduate school. When I talked to the California University system, they shit all over my DeVry degree. The reason that they gave was that their EE bachelors has 3 semesters of Calculus and Physics and DeVry only had 2. Calc/Physics III were prerequisites to every electronics class in junior and senior year so they would have required me to take those two classes plus retake 2 years worth of electronics classes and get a bachelors from them before I could start on their master's program. Private schools on the other hand, had no such prejudices. I was easily accepted to Santa Clara University and even Stanford would have only made me retake a couple classes. I actually know a couple people who got a master's from Stanford after getting their bachelor's at DeVry. I worked in a lab environment with people with degrees from Berkeley, Stanford, Purdue, etc. and had no trouble holding my own. In fact I was a better engineer than a lot of them in my own totally biased opinion.
In retrospect, as an 18 year old I think I should have just gone to a traditional school and had the "college" experience with girls and shit like that but if I was a 30 something with a wife and kids and a job who just wanted to get a degree with as little hassle as possible, it's a pretty solid option.
Not so sure about University of Phoenix. I have known people who got degrees from there and they didn't seem to be working that hard at it. I have one friend that did get into law school with a U of P master's degree, so I guess she got what she needed out of it.
Edit - In RE: Wormie
I didnt say that. I said I would take an online IT degree over a Suny something else degree. If its Apples to Apples then its different.
It all depends. If all they have are similar degrees to go on - then Yeah, Suny guy would probably win out. But I would never rule someone out based on an online degree in that same thought.
So if I get to 23 year old kids right out of school for a entry level job, I look at the degrees. If Online was in IT and SUNY (FYI I am just using SUNY as a shorter easier way of saying traditional college) was in bullshit then yeah, Id give the edge to the online degree. If they were the same I would give it to the SUNY degree. Now thats if its all thats on the resume. I still would factor in Internships, work experience, references. Its all cumulative to finding good candidates.
So in the end, my whole point is anyone who junks a resume based on where a degree came from is stupid.
To summarize this entire thread with a question: Why should anyone bother to go to an online only school when traditional colleges are offering degrees online as well? Seems to me the answer is to go traditional.
Because most traditional schools are new to Online Programs....and most people dont know they exist. There is no reason you would choose one over the other. But U of Phoenix Online has a stadium named after it, more commercials and its all people know.
Yes, technically all schools are "for profit". However, most traditional schools do more than simply make a profit, such as performing research, developing new technologies, and conducting studies in whichever fields they happen to specialize in. The "for profit" schools (read: Strayer, Kaplan, University of Phoenix) are purely focused on taking your money, teaching you, and giving you a diploma.
I don't think anyone who refers to such schools as "for profit" actually thinks that traditional schools aren't out to make a buck.
But lets not pretend EVERY school isnt. You think any top flight school does research, studies, field sports if it didnt lead them to ....MAKING MORE MONEY? You get the best academics to research exciting new technology to get grants to build bigger facilities to get more grants and attract more students and make more money. This is America.
Where did I say that?
You cetainly can use it to expand your science facilities so that you can bring in more staff to bring in more grants and funding. Like I said. If Alabama Football started losing money it would be cut immediately. If a research department becomes a financial liability it gets cut. At any school. More likely at a Small school than Harvard, but across the board.
If you think quality of education factors into Most schools then you live in a dream world.
This is a interesting thread.. I am 33 years old married, family, and I have zero college experience. I am currently an IT systems admin for a Medium size business. I make decent money(though i feel no where near industry standard), I have a few Industry Certifications and 14 years of IT experience. However I know that if I ever want to move on (which I am considering) if will be exceedingly difficult to obtain the type of Job I have now or better with more pay with out any type of degree.
I am currently researching online schools and while I know to stay away form Diploma mills, they can be attractive for certain people. I am currently looking as Western Governors University, which is an online accredited school to get a degree, and few more certifications under my belt as they are offered with the curriculum.
Any one have any thoughts on WGU ?
One day I hope to be as attractive and well spoken as Tuco!
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