Let them eat cake syndrome .
Usually I'd reserve this for the WTF thread but I think this deserves it's own.
'Affluenza' in Texas incites anger, lawsuits and call for jail time - latimes.com
Its literally the practice of saying because you are wealthy you don't have to go to jail, not even the buy your way out defense, but using it as the context of your defense.
I agree that the kid doesn't understand consequences very well, which is why he should spend 20 years in jail, Then he can appreciate what consequences his actions brought about.
The judge needs to be disbarred and sent to prison, and investigated for corruption.
The psychologist should be publicly lambasted for appreciating that the kid didn't understand the consequences, and conversely saying because he didn't he shouldn't suffer for it. How do you
teach consequences without using the correct punishment for them?
There should be a lot of public outrage for this I'd think.
Last edited by Voyce; 12-28-2013 at 08:20 PM.
Yeah quite enraging, hopefully the kid's familly get sued for every penny they've got and then they can't afford the holiday therapy for the kid and subsequently he'll go to jail :
Victims' families file multimillion dollar lawsuits again affluenza teen
Not everything on the internet is true - Abraham Lincoln
And the interview with the psychologist is so infuriating :
Not everything on the internet is true - Abraham Lincoln
Even if they get every dime from his family, that's trading lives for money. That's like German Wergild or something nuts, honestly the Judge infuriates me the most. He is the god damn single expectation of integrity, he needs to go to prison with the kid at this point--there's no way around it.
Certainly one of the most disgusting things I have ever seen. Texas is a fucking train wreck. No integrity anywhere.
Iirc the same judge put away a black teenager for 15+ years for a similar crime. Fun story all around.
Originally Posted by Dr. Mario Speedwagon
This is what happens when you have a legal system.
I believe the proper punishment would be to let the victim's families each take one shot at running the kid over with a truck. Only one try each, though.
Unless you have never driven drunk in your life, especially as a teen I don't want to hear all this pontification.
Family is going to lose all their money, and the kid gets one chance, just one chance to turn his life around or he goes to jail. And he's the one who has to live with all this. I think for some reason people go around assuming he's smug and happy for getting off.
Says more about those people than him. It's justice, not vengeance.
I remember on the news when this story broke they mentioned that as he ran from the crash scene leaving his friends to die or get arrested or whatever, he yelled back "I'm Ethan Couch I'll get you out of this!" or something. Who knows if that really happened. idk, if he had been poor and black that shit definitely would not have gone down. This definitely was not justice.
Plus fuck you, Justice is a fake word as I've explained a million times.
I hope the kid's family is financially crippled by the settlements. The environment that fostered his behavior is insane. His father gave him a secluded home to live in by himself, a car 3 years before he could drive, and money to buy drugs and booze. Sick fuck.
Also, not only did he kill 4 people trying to change a tire, he seriously injured 2 of the passengers in his truck. One has a serious brain injury an has been in a coma since the accident. To have no actual consequence for this (a few years in a spa isn't a consequence) is the absolute worst message society could possibly send to someone like this.
Last edited by Haast; 12-29-2013 at 03:59 PM. Reason: dat grammar fail
How the fuck does driving drunk not immediately give you the idea that he would kill someone? Drunk driving isnt illegal because you might only get into a fender bender, it's illegal because a vehicle is also a several thousand pounds of fast moving violent death if operated improperly. Screw intent, burn this kid at the fucking stake.
You won't know peace until you've had suffering.
It's retarded and I can't believe how swept to the side this shit is. The judge needs to go to prison, she can't be allowed to get away with this bull shit.
Since he didn't "understand" the consequences I really doubt he is all broken up about this. The guy deserves jail.
Donte Stallworth ( NFL) had a similar situation come up a few years ago.
Last edited by Rod-138; 12-30-2013 at 04:01 AM.
And the big problem I have with the verdict is the 'kid gets one chance or he goes to jail' bit seems like bullshit. If you can drunk drive and kill a family without a harsh penalty, why wouldn't you expect to escape a harsh penalty for failure to do whatever bullshit the judge ordered? All I can hope is that something in the legalese allows him to be retried with the same charges and he gets a different judge that isn't paid off or has his head up his ass.
I really hate my parents for not being rich and ignoring me as a child. Think of all the things I was never able to get away with.
Never driven drunk in my life. This is such an absolute bullshit verdict and I can't believe more people aren't upset about this.
Jait that may possibly be the worst post I've ever read
Can't get to that article, getting a 502 error. Give me a TL;DR
Or die trying.
Not everything on the internet is true - Abraham Lincoln
What bothers me is that, if affluenza is real (which is totally bullshit, but I digress), then why are we not punishing the people who GAVE him the affluenza? Lock up his parents for 20 years, each.
Yeah, kid was 16, those parents are at least partially responsible.
Being affluent has nothing to do with not understanding the consequences of your actions nor does it have anything to do with whether or not you should be held responsible for something.
It doesn't matter what your financial situation is, if you've never been held accountable for your actions you're going to be a shithead. If you grow up in a household where stealing is the everyday norm and encouraged and "fuck them if they don't like it, you're bigger than them, what are they going to do?" guess what, you're going to steal and you are going to grow up thinking it's OK. If your parents never punish you you'll never learn that every action has a consequence. This has nothing to do with how much money your family has.
If you live in a society where people are ignorant of the health risks associated with smoking, and everyone around you smokes, you'll probably smoke without ever knowing the consequences. Parents are responsible for teaching their kids accountability regardless of status.
That in and of itself is the biggest reason this entire verdict and "affluenza" defense is horse shit. Just look at the rape epidemic in Africa.
The legal system just excused shitty, absentee parenting because these people have money. Not every rich kid is a worthless piece of shit but if this is precedent, every single kid who grew up in an affluent family is now able to pretend they didn't know what they were doing, however the impoverished will never be able to make the same claim because... well there is no reason for the disconnect. It's just absolutely retarded pseudo crackpot psychology.
Last edited by Khane; 12-31-2013 at 12:53 AM.
I'm really poor so I don't understand responsibility or circumstance. I eat roaches ffs.
I work the night shift. When I was getting used to it, I drove home a few times so tired I fell asleep at the wheel. During those times, I was more of a danger to everyone on the road than all but the worst of the drunks, but I can tell people about this and receive nothing more than mild censure at worst. Some people even have sympathy. Then there's texting while driving. Not only have studies shown that this is many times more dangerous than DUI, but there have been multiple high-profile accidents that resulted in a lot of deaths. It's also much easier to avoid doing than driving under the influence, and of course much easier to avoid driving home tired after working a bunch of hours. But because it's not related to EVIL alcohol consumption, it's not even illegal in many states, and in the others it's just equivalent to a speeding ticket. Nobody really cares if you do it, either.
I'm very skeptical of anyone who claims they've never driven under the influence unless they don't drink at all or very rarely. 0.08 BAC is very easy to hit, everyone metabolizes alcohol at different rates and it can even vary wildly in the same person. If you drink enough sometimes you're still at this level even after going to sleep and waking up in the morning, I'd bet quite a few of Monday morning commuters are still technically "drunk" from the previous night.
Last edited by Xequecal; 12-31-2013 at 02:23 AM.
Also, I really should point out that the kid didn't "get off" in a legal sense, he was convicted. The judge just gave him a super-lenient sentence. This type of thing is going to happen from time to time when you give judges as much leeway in sentencing as we do. What do you want to do to fix it? Mandatory minimum sentences have a pretty poor track record when it comes to fairness for the poor and minorities, and implementing binding sentencing guidelines is actually unconstitutional. The Federal Sentencing Guidelines used to be binding, but the Supreme Court struck this down.
This was an unconscionable decision on the judges part. A friend of mine stupidly drove drunk one night and crashed his truck into a tree. He didn't hurt anyone (even he was OK), there was nobody else in the car with him but he was pretty far over the legal limit. He was also driving without a license but from a different offense. He spent a year in jail.
In what world are restless driving and texting while driving not a big deal? Divots exist precisely for the reason of keeping people awake and not driving off the fucking road. You're even told if you're passing out while driving to pull over and nap. Officer will come to your window and just make sure you're not drunk, otherwise you're fine. And texting and driving is the dumbest fucking thing in the world, and the penalties are rising across the country because of it.
name one.Oh, please. The fanaticism about drunk driving has become goddamn ridiculous. It's not about public safety anymore, just about the demonization of alcohol consumption in general. There's a whole list of things that you can do in a car that are just as dangerous or more dangerous that people do all the time, but because it's not related to evil evil booze, nobody has this attitude about any of those.
EDIT your post sounds like you are driving drunk and texting.
You realize this kid wasnt a .08, right? You also realize the kid was drunk AND using drugs, right?
Did we really have somebody "support" drunk driving because you could do other things worse in a car? For real?
For the record since you said you can't believe that we all don't drive under the influence, I personally never have.
Want to know why? Because I can control myself quite easily into drinking NOTHING when I need to drive. You went off on how complicated it is to do the math and metabolizing is different and all kinds of other bullshit. The math of 0 drinks when you need to drive is pretty damn simple.
I think you are just an alcoholic.
oderint dum metuant
Affluenza is when you have already VP decked out P99 toon, but want another decked out alt at the expense of other non-TMO members killing Phara Dar.
It is worse than almost anything else you can do in the car because you know ahead of time you need to make the right decision and you didn't. There isn't a person in the USA that doesn't know "drunk driving is bad". I mean come on now.
oderint dum metuant
Also, I'm not trying to say that because texting is worse, that DUI is somehow OK. But the fact is, if this kid had instead had his face glued to his iPhone when he wiped out this family and received this sentence, no one would really care. It certainly wouldn't make the front page of CNN with people calling for his head. This is despite the fact that texting and driving has been shown to be more dangerous than DUI. This logical disconnect is a problem.
Also, in regards to your other post, I'm not skeptical when people say they don't habitually drive under the influence. I'm skeptical when they claim they've never done it once in their entire life, even in their stupid teenage years. I think this is an important point to make when people start saying we need to execute drunk drivers, because at that point we need to execute almost everyone.
Pretty sure states have started giving out manslaughter for texting and driving in these kinds of situations also.
Execution for drunk driving is stupid. How ever probation for mass killing is more so .
Also I think "intent" in the legal sense doesn't necessarily pair up with the real definition. Like, he didn't intend to kill people so much as he had absolutely no regard for the lives of other humans. There is more evidence than just the fact that he drove drunk to back this up. But that is definitely part of it.
Executing anyone is stupid, much less this kid. Pretty sure that was just hyperbole. But he should be in prison most definitely.
I don't even get Xeq's argument. The kid was well above the 0.08. There is a big difference being blackout drunk and right at the threshold. Even the 0.08 is sort of assinine given such variability amongst people, and if anything should be lower, or google can hurry the hell up with KITT
However, stepping away from this incident, I think texting while driving is nearly as dangerous and irresponsible as driving buzzed (at or near the 0.08 limit). It shows even more disregard, because you might not realize you are around 0.08 but you made the conscious decision to text while driving. However, driving staggering, slurry drunk is by far worse than texting.
It means it isn't something like eating a burger and ketchup dripping out causing you to swerve a little. There is a huge leap from the myriad of dangerous things you can do and consciously driving with alcohol in your system.
It has a lot to do with the whole attitude though where people brag about how they can handle their liquor or that it's too complicated to figure out their BAC manually. I have seen way too many people at an event do some quick napkin math or in their head to figure out if they think their BAC is too much. Just do not drive at that point, ever. It is really that simple.
oderint dum metuant
I kind of want to get drunk and be handed a shotgun and see what happens. It should be ok as long as I don't understand right and wrong.
lol @ driving drunk as intent to kill. Words have specific meanings gentlemen.
1inĚtent noun \in-ˈtent\
: the thing that you plan to do or achieve : an aim or purpose
"Joe drove home drunk. This showed that his plan was to kill innocent pedestrians."
Last edited by Tuco; 12-31-2013 at 03:03 PM.
I got a DUI as an underage kid once for blowing a .034 thanks to different legal limits for underage people
I basically looked at alcohol and it cost me thousands of dollars
As for intent, let's not be ridiculous and change the meaning of words. Its clearly not intent because intent requires...intent.
I also do kind of agree with xeq. Driving at .2+ deserves crucifiction; however, a .09 DUI is not nearly in the same ballpark and isn't even overly dangerous. Yet they are sort of all lumped together, and a .09 DUI can ruin your life almost as much as a .2 can. The indignation people have (not here--people in general) about a just-barely DUI is silly especially when lots of these people are off texting and driving all the time.
Where do we draw the line with what alcohol does and doesn't do to our wits? Why can women claim rape when they are drunk even if they quite literally consented and intended to have sex? Why is it "intent to kill" if you have higher than .08 BAC and drive a vehicle? Don't be ridiculous.
The kid made a choice with wanton disregard for the consequences and now that ideal is being enforced by the legal system. He should definitely be locked up over this and for a long time. But I seriously doubt he intended to kill anyone or wreck his truck. All he intended to do was drive somewhere.
The intent of getting extremely drunk is to put yourself in a state where you will disregard preserving human life, your own and others. This is intent to kill.
DUI laws being abused and misused as a form of revenue generation is a problem, but that isnt the case. Kid was hammered drunk and high on drugs.Phoenix equated drunk driving with murderous intent and said you should get executed for it. Not just this kid's crime specifically, all drunk driving.
And my whole he deserves to be executed is a personal belief. Its pretty obvious kid would never be charged with 1st degree murder.
Last edited by Big Phoenix; 12-31-2013 at 03:31 PM.
The kid didn't know any better. Look at his parents track record, they a literally terrible people. I don't know if I would call it affluenza but he definitely suffers from the lavish and reckless lifestyle that his parents embellished him in.
We had something similar happen right across the street from my house. Bunch of kids got high on weed and got drunk and were speeding down the street. There was a very large boulder on the side of the road and they hit it, spiraling into the air and landing upside down. Everyone but the driver died, and he went to jail. He made a terrible decision to do what he did and he paid for the consequences.
Lots of soap boxes in this thread.
Just because texting and driving is just as bad doesn't make driving above the legal limit okay.
There was no intent to kill. However he is guilty of reckless endangerment and manslaughter.
I don't get the affluenza or even the simpler unable to distinguish right and wrong defense. It is completely irrevelvant, just how using neurological disorders as defense is flawed. You and are your brain, nothing more, nothing else.
Last edited by ZyyzYzzy; 12-31-2013 at 03:49 PM.
Not to mention that if it's .08 when you blew, it was higher than that when you got behind the wheel.
Last edited by The Ancient; 12-31-2013 at 04:03 PM.
He probably has five DUIs. Wouldn't be surprised if he's murdered.
And yes, double negatives all around. FUCK YOU.
Way to twist the point around. The poor black kid should go to jail, so should the rich white kid. Neither should be given leniency.
Chances are, the poor black kid would be locked up and probably hit with a slew of other charges like crack possession with intent to sell.
that is so wrong yet right on levels outside of this thread.
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